09:36:43 Maybe, maybe, if there is no questions at the moment let me start with Jake Can I ask you a quick question so in the interferometer a protocol that you turn on the lattice.
09:36:53 And we know that there are going to be contact interactions, and in principle these contact interactions can depend on temperature when you go to the wave, a.
09:37:05 I mean, there are very small, you have a great lead in order, but depending of the temperature of the items you can have higher other terms. So is there any way that you can.
09:37:10 I mean how we're going to get rid of that or how to distinguish what you're seeing from from deviation from from those type of interactions. So I think what I want to be clear about is the trouble you arrived, it comes into play when you're trying to
09:37:30 Now we don't always succeed, and particularly for long haul times it becomes hard as you as you get into.
09:37:36 Though I will say you know hungers results so far, actually suggested it works and so I was in an issue.
09:37:41 an admin a farmer is first to try and make it so some of the non drafting region.
09:37:43 But the next point is the actual protocol is looking for the collapse of coherence, and then revival.
09:37:52 And so I guess my question back to you as the atomic scattering expert is, you know, under what conditions and we're going to get a revival of coherence of the atomic cloud.
09:38:03 After I got destruction from the essay portion.
09:38:07 What depends I mean you can have effective when existing models that are a little bit integral and you might have collapse every vitals but yeah yeah I mean, but the other point is that whenever you do these types of experiments, it's crucial to show
09:38:20 that your signal is from gravity.
09:38:23 Yes, right. So, when I talk about do these experiments you do the performer, and you have to move the Master System.
09:38:33 Right, because you can move it so that it doesn't do a strong effective movement so it has a strong effect like just placing me, where the atoms are doing interference by small amounts that you pull out the gravitational effect from self interactions
09:38:45 in the atoms and other terms.
09:38:48 So I just want to be clear like you're not just looking for classroom Bob you're looking for classroom Bible that depends upon where the masses are looking at that helps.
09:38:57 That helps. Okay, okay, okay, great. Thanks. Yeah. So I see another in the chat there is question so I mean, we are enough discussion, period. So please unmute yourself and ask the questions that that's easy.
09:39:08 I mean, I think, a minute.
09:39:14 Yeah, thanks yeah so just wanted to ask Maria and if she can briefly mention this coin she raised about test detecting forces using atomic spectroscopy.
09:39:26 Yes, this is actually a very interesting recent idea and ideas to use of shifts so to use the system in which you can have a lot of isotopes for example with Terbium or consume.
09:39:41 And then what do you actually look for you need at least four isotopes in at least two transitions, and you build with all the kinks plot.
09:39:50 And in this case, it according to the normal standard model generally, it always assumed to be linear and it allows you to separate different kinds of shifts the field trips versus was just, it was shown that we have some sort of a fifth, fourth you cover
09:40:07 like tight coupling that this plot will become nonlinear. And that's why you that is for isotopes because then you can actually instead of the linear type plot, you can actually look at the deviation from the linearity.
09:40:21 So the great thing that you're not comparing the experiment with theory because such precision theory Facebook shift is actually not possible at this level.
09:40:29 So what you're comparing is essentially aware, with the graphics you're putting, whether you will have a deviation from the linearity.
09:40:38 The problem is you run into is that there is a standard model signal, which is nonlinear, and that have not been yet fully quantified, in this case however we actually have is a number of collaborators submit the proposal and that to both actually look
09:40:54 for our precision measurements and for to look for those Standard Model nonlinear effect. The great thing is is the more isotopes to get the moves me you can measure.
09:41:05 So if you can ask more for isotopes if you for example contrast measurements and six isotopes, then you can actually get rid of some of the nuclear physics parameters, things like Qd or eventually apparently violation would also be nonlinear and but that
09:41:18 had been estimate.
09:41:19 So you have kind of two cases for example Coulson when you have lots of isotopes, and you expect more or less at the be linear, or you can have a 31 year non linearity signal with the larger but then you have even more isotopes and you can probably measure
09:41:34 them away. And in this case you eventually would have to use more stable isotopes, because you just don't have enough table one, and you have to use the system zero.
09:41:42 And that's the basic idea is very promising.
09:41:45 It's one of the ways to reach the parameter space for certain
09:41:53 types of the fifth force interaction that's a scalar type interaction, its meaning that people haven't yet figured out I think how to look for independent interaction that way if you do that actually also particularly interested.
09:42:06 But that's the basic idea, you, you need a lot of different transitions, and a lot of highs of books in also using highly stressed science you can actually have much much easier theory, because in this case we just have a few electrons in there, so it
09:42:20 doesn't really matter. You can combine measurements and ions highly charged minds and neutrals. In this case,
09:42:31 please go ahead Andrew.
09:42:33 Yeah, really nice talks this morning I had a follow up, I guess to the previous question for Jake about the Adam interferometer with the lattice implementation.
09:42:42 So just wondering sort of what lengths scales separation distances from the atoms to the mass we're thinking about and I'm thinking about this in the context of trying to isolate only gravitational interactions from other kinds of backgrounds, which might
09:42:54 otherwise produce signals.
09:42:56 So I'm actually there's a few points there, first of all, links skill wise.
09:43:01 We think a lot about this sort of 10 micron to 10 millimeters.
09:43:06 As the range of visibility.
09:43:09 So below 10 microns, the six coefficients just too big and you're going to be dominated by them kind of getting Adams to be coherent and hold them for life skills on the order millimeter becomes very very challenging.
09:43:24 So that's kind of the range you get to play with.
09:43:29 I will say that actually the non gravitational interaction dramatically improves the experiment.
09:43:37 And so, we call this pre charging if you will or amplification so if you're familiar with quantum metrology you know there's this idea of like fish information.
09:43:49 And there's like a maximum extraction that you can do for a particular parameter.
09:43:54 And so, in single atom physics if you already have an atom with the coherence, then it's easy to drive that coherence around but it's, it's quite decreed clearance is quadratic ineptitude.
09:44:06 Once you have it, then it's linear and drive.
09:44:08 So actually, if you have a C six TV which causes these things to dangle the masses, and the gravitational interaction. And you can flip the sign of the interaction which you can do by started with the atoms in a meditative state and putting them down.
09:44:23 them down. Or alternatively using magnetic interaction, then you can actually take the integration time requirements down by orders of magnitude, because you can get yourself in a pre entangled state.
09:44:35 And then sort of increase and decrease then take them on a small amount from the gravitational portion.
09:44:41 And by seeing the decrease fall but increase you can still get the same groups output.
09:44:46 So anyway I want to mention that actually having some interaction is not bad by itself.
09:44:50 In fact, it can be a benefit. The trick is just distinguishing them. And there you really relying on the long range physics, which means it's really really critical dr Adams not be charged.
09:45:02 But the good news is, that's easy.
09:45:05 With masses it's hard to know that the destruction, but even one of our four is going to be fine. in the setting.
09:45:12 Thanks, and then as far as how well you know these other interactions to the extent that you can tune, you know parameters and whatnot, how important is that in terms of these are much much bigger signals right then.
09:45:24 Yeah, yeah. Short answer is they're very important.
09:45:27 You know conveniently there's this sort of Ramsey differential signal from the differential acceleration, which is the background, which allows you to calibrate where the masses are themselves.
09:45:36 And then you're looking for this classroom Bible on top of it so there's there's sort of three stages.
09:45:42 You know my stance and I'm talking about the lot, is that the first or first experiments something is actually quite doable today, but it has loopholes.
09:45:50 Right. And so the experimental program is really closing loopholes.
09:45:55 Over the course of 10 years to really go from a proof of principle to something that says, oh, now we're down to the base assumptions that we need to make better assumptions soon.
09:46:04 that's my takeaway.
09:46:06 Thanks.
09:46:08 Great ego.
09:46:13 But, yeah, thanks yeah thanks excellent talks, both of them and thanks for organizing this conference. So my question is actually very related so that's that's a good fit so it's for project, half question have common, namely also specifically for this
09:46:28 proposal for a using entanglement and then look at these collapse and revivals it relies on these revival peaks and like you mentioned, the temperature actually is even of the surrounding could be beneficial and some songs that this is remix it so the
09:46:44 comment and the question is the following. It's reminiscent of something that's also done in the work on collapse. So one of the first proposals was the Marshall adult proposal by the Bouwmeester group and Penrose, and where they also look at this columns,
09:46:57 and then we had a full of work at clicking around 2009, we're actually when you look more closely about when you have the temperature, even though it looks like it helps you it closes the bandwidth of where your revival comes in.
09:47:09 So it makes make the revival extremely narrow such as actually at, you know, Even small temperatures, you already have, you know, to narrow revival to actually resolve.
09:47:19 So, I'm not sure if you looked at this kind of revival narrowness to see that there is actually a limitation on temperature, makes it a bit more difficult.
09:47:31 Yeah, so thank you so one of the key points that the reason that temperature helps you in these types of proposals.
09:47:38 Is that what's happening with the atom is the item is putting an impulse on this object.
09:47:42 And the impulse translates to energy as the momentum plus the impulse squared.
09:47:48 So, a thermal state of the oscillator can absorb it gets more energy per impulse, because it has a higher initial momentum.
09:47:59 But at the same time I need to maintain my assumption of this time translation and variant channel.
09:48:04 And that means that I can't just prepare the oscillator and sometimes it has to be thermal, because that's my time translation and variant channel that keeps it in that state.
09:48:13 And so the assumption requires me to use the thermal state rather than a prepared state, just as assignment.
09:48:25 But then, in terms of the narrowness of revival I don't know what you mean by narrow, I've got to be completely honest. I will say that the revival is this very small feature.
09:48:29 Right, it's not a lot of collapsing revival so that you have to this is why pre untangling for example helps a lot to clarify narrowness I mean in time, so the time result because their arrival is exactly the full period.
09:48:42 Yeah, so that, that becomes extremely narrowed higher temperature that is the limitation that actually the limitation for higher temperature that we find before we get to the narrowing problem.
09:48:51 So we have pretty broad classroom Bible right now because it's very weak coupling.
09:48:55 The actual limitation is that the thing starts moving too much.
09:49:00 So there's a physical link scale which you can allow this thing jostling around, and it moves too much, then your assumptions the experiment breakdown right like it starts to impinge upon the optical beam.
09:49:10 So actually we found that like once like the scale of temperature where starts moving around on the order of a micro meter is probably the limit from other considerations before you get to the narrowing that you described.
09:49:28 Alright, so I we are approaching the time for a break so but let's, I let this goes the last ice on one hand racing, is that correct uh no pun, there is hundreds.
09:49:43 There are only was the prior one.
09:49:45 Yes, sir. So I just wanted to comment I think what Igor and Jake.
09:49:51 And I think, so one of the key, key, key issues. Is this eddy currents, and I think.
09:49:59 But, nevertheless, these are all classical effects, these are not quantum effects per se. So in principle, you can if you if you if you know your background, extremely extremely well, you can get rid of all these effects in a way, these are not really
09:50:15 because of any point fluctuations which is causing your defacing effects.
09:50:20 So, just to be very very clear.
09:50:23 I stated that the two critical mathematical assumptions.
09:50:28 And what you're talking about is in the first assumption, the time translation and verint channel.
09:50:33 So when you talk about classical noise you're talking about noise that has this correlation.
09:50:38 And if you measure it and then start the experiment with a particular measured value, right, and then go forward, then you've actually made a channel that's not time translation and.
09:50:50 So breaks the assumption.
09:50:53 Which is why I said, there's loopholes and you have to keep cutting out the loopholes over time so I encourage you, if you want to get we had a loophole table in our paper.
09:51:01 And that's one of them right like that, indeed, this assumption time transition variance to prove that you haven't time translation in various channels but challenging.
09:51:09 The best way I know to do it is to actually show that the channel is fully formalizing.
09:51:15 And then you can deduce from that for thermals and property that is time translation and verint.
09:51:27 But then you have the whole experiment that got the problem experiment becomes not showing classroom revival which is hard, but it's actually showing that the mass is in the sort of purely physical environment.
09:51:31 And so we've done this experimentally with optimum mechanics, up to about room temperature.
09:51:37 In the last few years ago, a few years ago at NIST, so it is possible that it is damn hard. pardon my language.
09:51:47 Great, so it has been very nice discussion I think let's a break I mean I know that these discussion in songs are exhausting so on, let's prepare ourselves for the very nice exciting dogs in the morning.
09:52:04 So, let us recombine, a 10am, or we are going to have the stock.
09:52:06 So, yes, we will be all back in just a minute.
09:52:13 Thank you very much for the nice discussion and see you in a bit.
09:52:17 Thanks all.